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Good artists copy but Great artists steal: Apple Versus Samsung (Picasso or Jobs ? )

Good artists copy but Great artists steal: Apple Versus Samsung (Picasso or Jobs ? )

So let’s get the quote thing straight: It was Picasso that came up with the quote.

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“Good artists copy but Great artists steal” -Picasso

N O T  Steve Jobs. But around the web (and for our category “Forums All Kind of talk)  the geek fight of Apple users Versus Samsung users goes and goes and some seem to know how to handle google and a book better than others (in the quote department).

Picasso truly embodies this quote, as he did in fact “steal” ideas from his colleague, Braque. Though Picasso is probably best known for establishing Cubism, Braque was always a step ahead of Picasso. However, Picasso was much more of a prolific painter than Braque, so Picasso would work through a concept that Braque had come up with much faster than Braque himself. For example, Braque was the first one to begin using faux-bois (fake wood pattern) that was so crucial in the development of synthetic cubism, but it was Picasso who used it to attribute a different meaning to the pattern and further the idea of synthetic cubism. So it is undeniable that Picasso was a savvy artist, to say the least. Not to mention all the African Art that Picasso supposedly invented.

Merely copying isn’t particularly creative work, though it’s useful as training and practice. Being inspired by someone else’s idea to produce something new and different IS creative work, and it may even revolutionalize the “stolen” concept.

But note that there’s a difference between flat-out plagiarizing and meditating very creatively on an earlier artist. See below for a good example of the latter:

Source(s):

2

But the fun around the web on this discussion goes on and on :

“Hello.” shut up.. in fact Jobs said “good artists copy, great artists steal” the phrase was not originaly from him, but is the form that he thought.

Some products like ipod are inspired from Braun products , What do you say about?

http://www.cultofmac.com/188753/the-braun-products-that-inspired-apples-iconic-designs-gallery/

Apples copied to app clock a iconic Swiss watch, What do you say about?

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/09/20/swiss-federal-railways-says-apple-copied-its-iconic-railway-clock/

Apple copied too, Its the fact.

Linkhak on 04.30.13 4:38p

 

It’s a matter of degree. First, Apple didn’t “copy” any Braun products. Ive is a student of Ram’s design philosophy; he adheres to Ram’s principles of design and endorses the notion of simplicity as honest design. Rams has praised Ive for his work at Apple, so on that point you’re essentially wrong.

That Apple copied the Swiss clock design (not a watch design) is true, but this is a good illustration of the degree to which Apple may copy and its competitors copy Apple. Apple copied the design for a clock face, which is subsequently licensed. But Samsung copied Apple’s entire UI, and published a 120+ page document dedicated to the task.

We measure things in terms of degree. The degree to which Samsung copied Apple is exceptional, and far above any amount that Apple has ever copied from any company..

bobrovsky on 04.30.13 5:24p

It’s not the case that Samsung has made its products better. The hard work has been done by Google, which has steadily improved Android as a viable iOS competitor. Samsung’s hardware is subpar in many respects: lower quality screens (pentile), lower quality material construction, and so on. Samsung’s software has been universally assessed as poor, and its design language is muddled.

In any event, since Samsung hasn’t ever created or contributed meaningfully to the development of a product category, the comparison between Samsung and Apple is very inappropriate. The issue here is one of degree. Apple has certainly taken an iterative approach, but Apple has been primarily responsible for setting the course of multiple product categories. Conversely, Samsung has undertaken wholesale duplication of Apple’s products without making any iterative improvements.

Unfortunately Apple failed in its attempt to remedy Samsung’s behavior in court, and somewhat surprisingly, Samsung has used the lawsuits to its advantage in the media and in its marketing (including its shady marketing, such as paying students to talk down competitors like HTC and Apple). What is less surprising is that Samsung has been emboldened in its shameful copying, and we should probably expect the trend to continue.

But we can still call a spade a spade. Samsung is a shameless copyist.

bobrovsky on 04.30.13 9:02a

1

Arguably the only device that really copied Apple was the Galaxy S with original firmware. It was a shameless iPhone 3GS knock off, looking similar on the inside and outside. Since then though, about the only thing you can call them out for is the TouchWiz launcher and its grids of icons, but even that has been improved vs. the Apple counterpart.

Having owned an iPhone, Windows Phone and many Android phones, it seems clear to me that everyone innovates off everyone else. Samsung might have pushed this rather far, and suffered for it, but let’s not forget that Apple borrowed the slide to unlock from Neonode, nicked the pull-down notifications from Android and appropriated the industrial design from Dieter Rams. They didn’t do any of it first – they were just the first to wrap it all up into a coherent mobile package.

Personally I’d like to see Samsung get away with a slap on the wrist in this one. The court needs to send a message to Apple that they can’t sue their way out of a stagnating product line, and that it’s OK for innovation to build on the work of others. Like Steve Jobs used to say – “good artists copy, great artists steal.”

ref1ux on 04.30.13 9:11a

 

 

“good artists copy, great artists steal.”

Unfortunately this is not what Steve Jobs meant at all. He was referring to designers and product engineers taking inspiring from other facets of life and putting those essences into product designs – not simply taking the work from one company and repackaging it into another company. Good artists copy nature. Great artists steal nature.

Please don’t attribute quotes if you don’t understand what they mean.

And no, Apple didn’t take Xerox’s GUI. If you know the history, you will know that Xerox’s GUI work, while highly innovative, was very incomplete and certainly not consumer-facing. Even if Apple’s GUI was a derivative of Xerox, it iterated to a large extent on it, making the contribution meaningful – in the same way that Windows was a meaningful derivative. What Samsung has done in terms of its software layer is not meaningful in any way.

bobrovsky on 04.30.13 9:40a

 

So Samsung were copying S.Jobs by insisting to copy nature in their Galaxy SIII and Nature UX they have going on. Holy Crap it’s worse than we all thought!

lol.

greatestNothing on 04.30.13 9:42a

 

No, that was just Samsung designers trying to be creative but falling flat. Also drugs.

bobrovsky on 04.30.13 9:43a

 

Wow. There are some misunderstandings here.

1st paragraph: and the Galaxy S2 was a copy too. If you follow the news, you can see they still copy today (example: samsung wallet), it is very frequent.

Apple borrowed the slide to unlock from Neonode

No they didn’t. It is completely different. I still don’t understand how people can think they are the same thing.

nicked the pull-down notifications from Android

… which existed before as a jailbreak tweak.

and appropriated the industrial design from Dieter Rams.

Jony says he’s inspired by Rams’ work. But he didn’t copy anything. The philosophy is the same, not the products. Even if he copied, it would be design elements from totally different products (thermostat, speaker, turntable) that are 40years old! Dieter Rams is honored by Jony’s work.

they were just the first to wrap it all up into a coherent mobile package.

Few new things + implementation of unheard, uninteresting things + good execution and various improvements = new innovative product.
Innovative product + slight changes to make it different (and worse) = shameless copy/Samsung.

Personally I’d like to see Samsung get away with a slap on the wrist in this one.

So HTC, Nokia and Sony continue to struggle and the market becomes a duopoly?
Apple will be fine whatever the result is. The lawsuit is important for the other companies.

The court needs to send a message to Apple that they can’t sue their way out of a stagnating product line

Yeah, please tell me how other companies (Samsung especially) were more innovative than Apple.

Like Steve Jobs used to say – “good artists copy, great artists steal.”

You don’t understand the quote. Please google it. And it’s not from Steve Jobs.

 

“Marketing isn’t the only key to sales, and if they really are just sloppy clones, then /why are people buying them if they cost the same as an iPhone?/

There’s no doubt Samsung borrowed liberally from Apple, especially in the early android days. And likely they deserve to pay (though the outrageous award in this trial is suspect), though they gained more from this trial than any marketing push in terms of mindshare and branding of their Galaxy brand.

IMO they provide a lot of features the competitors within Android don’t, and they aren’t shooting for the same kind of design qualities Apple and HTC are these days, rather they focus on user end features of design. There are some merits, though Samsung is riding partly on google’s design strength by simply being the best marketed and overall consistent android product in terms of branding.”

UtopiaNH on 04.30.13 4:19p

“Samsung phones are cheaper, especially when you factor in storage and repairs.

However, the Galaxy S3 sold millions fewer units than both the iPhone 4S and the iPhone 5.

Samsung spends the most on marketing which is one of the largest drivers of sales.

Also, many people prefer Android to iOS.”

MadMen on 04.30.13 6:11p

 

Read this article: http://www.asymco.com/2012/11/29/the-cost-of-selling-galaxies/

Samsung spends far more than any of its competitors in marketing, promotions, and advertising.

bobrovsky on 04.30.13 6:14p

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You have obviously never had an original idea then I guess. While I think some of the patents are ridiculous and I am a fan of Android, I feel Samsung went completely out of their way to copy, the original Galaxy S looked like a KRF. It is one thing to be inspired by another but something entirely different when they flat out copy down to the finest detail. The original galaxy S was so blatant. It even took icons and superimposed them on a rounded background. Many of these copies unnecessary to compete. It is like Huawei copying Cisco, they even copied the grammatical errors in the manuals.

mola2alex on 04.30.13 5:02p

Samsung wrote a 130+ page report on how to copy the iPhone. There were no such reports presented for any of samsungs other competitors. I can’t believe that people are still trying to deny that Samsung was guilty of this.

jayfehr on 04.30.13 2:06p

As in:
http://mobile.theverge.com/2013/4/30/4285032/apple-and-samsung-set-to-battle-over-damages-this-november
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100226121955AA5dgbh

Bob Marley and Doo-wop Rare Tapes

 

 

Bob Marley and Doo-wop Rare Tapes

Epic-Bob-Marley-Quote

“Only once in your life, I truly believe, you find someone who can completely turn your world around. You tell them things that you’ve never shared with another soul and they absorb everything you say and actually want to hear more. You share hopes for the future, dreams that will never come true, goals that were never achieved and the many disappointments life has thrown at you. When something wonderful happens, you can’t wait to tell them about it, knowing they will share in your excitement. They are not embarrassed to cry with you when you are hurting or laugh with you when you make a fool of yourself. Never do they hurt your feelings or make you feel like you are not good enough, but rather they build you up and show you the things about yourself that make you special and even beautiful. There is never any pressure, jealousy or competition but only a quiet calmness when they are around. You can be yourself and not worry about what they will think of you because they love you for who you are. The things that seem insignificant to most people such as a note, song or walk become invaluable treasures kept safe in your heart to cherish forever. Memories of your childhood come back and are so clear and vivid it’s like being young again. Colours seem brighter and more brilliant. Laughter seems part of daily life where before it was infrequent or didn’t exist at all. A phone call or two during the day helps to get you through a long day’s work and always brings a smile to your face. In their presence, there’s no need for continuous conversation, but you find you’re quite content in just having them nearby. Things that never interested you before become fascinating because you know they are important to this person who is so special to you. You think of this person on every occasion and in everything you do. Simple things bring them to mind like a pale blue sky, gentle wind or even a storm cloud on the horizon. You open your heart knowing that there’s a chance it may be broken one day and in opening your heart, you experience a love and joy that you never dreamed possible. You find that being vulnerable is the only way to allow your heart to feel true pleasure that’s so real it scares you. You find strength in knowing you have a true friend and possibly a soul mate who will remain loyal to the end. Life seems completely different, exciting and worthwhile. Your only hope and security is in knowing that they are a part of your life.”
― Bob Marley


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Bob Marley (February 6, 1945 – May 11, 1981), born Nesta Robert Marley which was later to be changed by passport officials to Robert Nesta Marley, was a Jamaican , guitarist, and activist. He was the most widely known writer and performer of , and more specifically . He is famous for popularising the genre outside of Jamaica and the Caribbean. Much of his music dealt with the struggles of the spiritually wealthy rasta and/or spiritually powerful Jah Rastafari.

Bob Marley was a member of this Rastafari movement, whose culture was a key element in the development of reggae. Bob Marley became the leading proponent of the Rastafari, taking their music out of socially deprived areas of Jamaica and onto the international music scene.


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Now considered a “Rasta” prophet, Marley’s adoption of the characteristic Rastafarian dreadlocks and famous use of marijuana as a sacred sacrament in the late sixties were an integral part of his persona. He is said to have entered every performance proclaiming the divinity of Jah Rastafari.

A few months before his death, Marley was baptised into the Ethiopian Orthodox Church and took the name Berhane Selassie (meaning the Light of the Holy Trinity in Amharic).

His best known crossover songs are a mixture of reggae, rock, and rhythm and blues, which include “I Shot the Sheriff”, “No Woman No Cry”, “Exodus”, “Could You Be Loved”, “Jamming”, and “Redemption Song”. His posthumous album Legend (1984) became the best-selling reggae album ever, with sales of more than 12 million copies.

Marley tragically died of cancer at Cedars of Lebanon Hospital in Miami, Florida on May 11, 1981.

In 1993, Marley was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Time magazine chose Bob Marley & The Wailers’ album Exodus as the greatest album of the 20th century.

Religion:

Bob Marley was a member of the Rastafari movement, (not rastafaranism as that is seen as a derogortory term as Rasta’s don’t like being refered to as an ism) whose culture was a key element in the development of reggae music in Jamaica. Rastas belive they are outcast from their native Zion and looked on Ethiopia as their real home and Tafarai Makonnen, who took the title Haile Sellasie I(Power of the Holy Trinity in Amharic), after he became the emperor of Ethiopia, as their leader. Rastas belive H.I.M. is Jesus in flesh. Rastas are considered to be black Jews. Rastas claim their root from King Solomon and Abbysinian queen of Sheba, through lineage of their son Menelik, emperor of Abbysinia. H.I.M. is said to be a direct decendant of Menelik. ‘Ras’ means Head and ‘Tafarai” means Creator. ‘Jah’ is the shortened form of the Hebrew word Jehovah. Rastas belive in one truth and that is the truth of His Imperial Majesty, Emperor Haile Sellasie I, King of kings, Lord of lords, conquering Lion of the tribe of Judah, two hundred and twenty-fifth ruler of the three thousand year old Ethiopian empire, elect of Jah, Light of the world. Jah Rastafari live out.Rastas preach a non-materialistic, egalitarian way of life. Bob Marley became a leading proponent of the Rastafari, taking their music out of the socially deprived areas of Jamaica and onto the international music scene. Bob Marley was baptized by the Archbishop of the Ethiopian Orthodox Christian Church in Kingston, Jamaica on November 4, 1980. Marley’s diet was ital; fruit, vegetables and fish; which is food approved by the Rastafari movement.

Bob Marley had 13 children: three with his wife Rita, two adopted from Rita’s previous relationships, and the remaining eight with separate women.[19] His children are, in order of birth:

Imani Carole, born May 22, 1963, to Cheryl Murray;
Sharon, born November 23, 1964, to Rita in previous relationship;
Cedella born August 23, 1967, to Rita;
David “Ziggy”, born October 17, 1968, to Rita;
Stephen, born April 20, 1972, to Rita;
Robert “Robbie”, born May 16, 1972, to Pat Williams;
Rohan, born May 19, 1972, to Janet Hunt;
Karen, born 1973 to Janet Bowen;
Stephanie, born August 17, 1974; according to Cedella Booker she was the daughter of Rita and a man called Ital with whom Rita had an affair; nonetheless she was acknowledged as Bob’s daughter;
Julian, born June 4, 1975, to Lucy Pounder;
Ky-Mani, born February 26, 1976, to Anita Belnavis;
Damian, born July 21, 1978, to Cindy Breakspeare;
Makeda, born May 30, 1981, to Yvette Crichton.


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Bob Marley Top Tracks HERE thanks to last.fm

Bob Marley and Doo-wop Rare Tapes

According to an article in The New York Times, Marley experimented on the tape with different sounds, adopting a doo-wop style on “Stay With Me” and “the slow love song style of 1960′s artists” on “Splish for My Splash”.

What is strange, especially for those accustomed to his reggae, is the style in which Marley sings. On one track, ”Stay With Me,” Marley sings in an almost doo-wop style; on another ”Splish for My Splash,” he appropriates the slow love song style of 1960′s artists like Sam Cooke.

Sometime in the spring of 1968, a lanky, clean-cut 23-year-old Jamaican arrived at an apartment on Valentine Avenue in the Bronx with a guitar and a future no one could have possibly imagined.

He was Bob Marley, who eventually sold tens of millions of albums and built reggae into an international musical movement but who at this point was dead set on learning the mysteries of rhythm and blues. To that end he had gone to the Bronx to sit at the heels of Jimmy Norman, then a 31-year-old composer and crooner who had written dozens of hit songs for the singer and producer Johnny Nash. Mr. Nash had just signed Marley to his record label, JAD Records.

”He was just a nice young guy who loved music,” Mr. Norman recalled. ”He loved the Impressions, and he loved James Brown.”

The two men, along with Marley’s wife, Rita, and Mr. Norman’s writing partner, Al Pyfrom, jammed for the next three days. Then Mr. Norman set up a tape recorder and recorded 24 minutes of music onto a cassette that soon disappeared.

It was not played again for 34 years, during which time Marley become a global superstar and died of cancer at 36 in 1981. Forgotten by Mr. Norman, the tape remained in a box of cassettes in his apartment on the Upper West Side until it was discovered last June by a volunteer from the Jazz Foundation of America who was cleaning the place. By JESSE McKINLEY for The New York Times

Bob Marley Stay With Me Demo 1968

 

Bob Marley Splish For My Splash **Original**

 


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As in

http://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/25241.Bob_Marley

http://www.last.fm/music/Bob+Marley/+wiki

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/19/arts/pre-reggae-tape-of-bob-marley-is-found-and-put-on-auction.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Marley

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Do you think Madonna, Cher and Britney fart on stage while dare singing?

Do you think Madonna, Cher and Britney fart on stage while dare singing?

While we hardly would consider it, some  users around the web care enough to create some buzz around the web -enough for us to post it- in the ever demanding category Forums (all kind of talk).

cher

Regarding Cher we only found a tweet with the words Fart. One thing is certain: Blessed the one who endure a Cher fart as it is the ultimate lifting.

Regarding food definitely Britney rules. But only for this talk only has Cristina Aguilera is a ever evolving  competition who dares to beat Cee  Lo Green very soon ( and not only in the tan department).  And Aguilera just let it hit the fan:

Aguilera stated that she doesn’t like to sit too close to the not-so funky fresh star when they make appearances together.

She told DeGeneres, “(I’m sitting) between Blake and Cee Lo with his gas over there…That’s why I have the fan, you know.”

Afraid she may have upset her pal, Aguilera quickly laughed off her comment and added, “I love you Cee Lo. Don’t be mad. Everybody knows.”


aguilera

The web is a weird place and the talks go on and on. We have to mention evidently the proud flabby Adele and Beyonce. These girls rock but they do have an issue in the ever  demanding toned and slim  bodies show biz has accustomed  us all. adele

According to the Daily Star  “Adele is still at the top of the charts because no one can move her!”.. .And Adele didn’t like it.. .so we are not going to shove it down her throat.

But has for farting Britney has an entire territory on her own :

“Based on his former experience as a police officer, Flores said Spears’ farting could be described as a lethal weapon,” said Flores’ attorney, Raimondo Guarez.  “My client has seen cops overcome with the smell from flatulence and he felt that he was assaulted every day by Spears and her farts.”

Doctors confirm that the fumes from Spears’ farts could be deadly to some.  “Yes, they can cause some people to choke and some may even stop breathing.”

Lawyers for Spears have filed a motion saying the allegations are exaggerated.  But, more importantly, they say that Spears has a rare condition – Flatulencia Explotatta – that affects less than 1% if the population.  “She can’t help it. She’s been do the best doctors in the world.  It’s a disease.”

britney-spears-fat

According to  zippy huntoon· 


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This is a national tragedy, a beautiful woman like that hampered by a belly full of gas. How would you like to go through life unable to eat chili? Those of you who think it is a laughing matter, shame on you. I have heard that she didn’t shave her head, it was actually burnt off by lighting one of her powerful @$$ explosions. K Fed once stated that it was a Britney lead dutch oven that drove him to divorce. Britney we love you gas or no gas.

Madonna needs a crown has the skinny queen. If it was trauma from her flabby like a virgin days or not, truth is that accordingly to her brother biography the self proclaimed Queen of Pop might have start his diet while performing Like a Virgin for MTV with a “green liquid diarrhea”- we leave the gory details aside. And she never went back! She keep on being as toned and fit until today, putting Brit and Christina to shame with half her age.

madonna arms

So let’s go to the All kind of Talk:

Resolved Question

Do you think madonna cher and britney fart on stage while dare singing?

i was thinking do you think Madonna Cher Britney ever fart while they are singing

cher singing believe
madonna singing 4 mins
and britney singing gimmie more do u think they ever let one off loudly lol

Best Answer - Chosen by Voters

I don’t think Cher or Madonna eat enough to produce a fart.

Britney however is a self admitted junk food addict. I’m sure she’s and expert at the “silent but deadly” type.

I would prefer to listen to that anytime. Can’t stand Cher, she will fall to bits soon and Madonna too. I like Britney and she can fart God save the Queen and I would still like her and Amy Winehouse.
Another user: 
They all need to be mic’d up – little mic stands and good quality microphones, shouldn’t miss a single squeak…. Mmmm, diva methane is tops and with the right amount of sphincter control the resultant sound could be quite musical… xx
And the update :
 fergie from Black Eyed Peas pissed herself on stage once.
The pics were all over the media.
This goes on and on. Its the web 



ticket liquidator

As in

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Entertainment/Tabloid/Adele-hurt-over-fat-jokes-on-her/Article1-814208.aspx

http://www.funnyordie.com/articles/3bd8f00757/the-12-most-revealing-excerpts-from-the-tell-all-madonna-book

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AifJF0T8PRvdLtdXMg828jOw.Bd.;_ylv=3?qid=20080909063213AARL9O0

http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity-news/news/adam-levine-voice-judges-stopped-farting-in-front-of-christina-aguilera-201212

Tips to be Perfect

Tips to be Perfect

tips1 Diet and exercise

1.Get some sleep.

2.Eat an orange every morning.

3.Be friendly. It will help make you happy.

4.Hope for everything. Expect nothing.

5.Take care of things close to home first. Straighten up your room
before you save the world. Then save the world.
Be nice to people before they have a chance to behave badly.

6.Don’t stay angry about anything for more than a week, but don’t
forget what made you angry. Hold your anger out at arm’s length
and look at it, as if it were a glass ball. Then add it to your glass 
ball collection.

7.Wear comfortable shoes.

8.Do not spend too much time with large groups of people.

9.Plan your day so you never have to rush.

10.Show your appreciation to people who do things for you, even if
you have paid them, even if they do favors you don’t want.


11.After dinner, wash the dishes.

12.Calm down.

13.Don’t expect your children to love you, so they can, if they want 
to.
zenfrog
14.Don’t be too self-critical or too self-congratulatory.

15.Don’t think that progress exists. It doesn’t.

16.Imagine what you would like to see happen, and then don’t do
anything to make it impossible.

17.Forgive your country every once in a while. If that is not 
possible, go to another one.

18.If you feel tired, rest.

19.Don’t be depressed about growing older. It will make you feel 
even older. Which is depressing.

20.Do one thing at a time.


AVG Internet Security Business Edition 2012

21.If you burn your finger, put ice on it immediately. If you bang
your finger with a hammer, hold your hand in the air for 20
minutes. you will be surprised by the curative powers of ice and
gravity.
zen1
22.Do not inhale smoke.

23.Take a deep breath.

24.Do not smart off to a policeman.

25.Be good.

26.Be honest with yourself, diplomatic with others.

27.Do not go crazy a lot. It’s a waste of time. 

28.Drink plenty of water. When asked what you would like to 
drink, say, “Water, please.”

29.Take out the trash.

30.Love life.


31.Use exact change.

32.When there’s shooting in the street, don’t go near the window.

Excerpts from “How to be Perfect” by Ron Padgett, from How to be Perfect. © Coffee House Press, 2007.


How focused are the Chinese cyber attacks ?

What fascinates me about the exploits of officially sanctioned Chinese cyber attacks is how limited they are.”

How focused are the Chinese cyber attacks?

chin1

Perhaps the more accurate statement should read, “how FOCUSED they are”.

Chinese cyber espionage efforts are actually quite broad. From critical infrastructure, to the Defense Industrial Base, to university R&D efforts, the PLA has placed massive resources into pursuing focused cyber espionage/Computer Network Exploitation (CNE) of virtually every industry in the country. Sadly, much of the evidence is either classified or what would be termed “circumstantial” in American legalese, but taken as a whole, the signs all point to massive state support from China.

Can the U.S. claim the moral high ground? No, but U.S. CNE efforts abroad are limited to the intelligence/military community, and valuable discoveries not shared with U.S. businesses to further commercial interests. The Chinese cannot make a similar claim. Well, they can, but not honestly.

In the article for The Week, Marc Ambinder says:

(…) What fascinates me about the exploits of officially sanctioned Chinese cyber attacks is how limited they are. The Times found that the hackers were interested in and only interested in what the Times would say about the Wen family. “Experts found no evidence that the intruders used the passwords to seek information that was not related to the Wen family.” Read that again. Based on what our government tells us, we think the Chinese government’s hacking efforts are indiscriminate. But they’re not. The net is sometimes wide, but the hackers seem to play by their own peculiar set of rules. If a person has information that pertains to the security environment as perceived by the Chinese government, then they’re fair game for computer network attack.


The United States plays by these informal rules too. Our NSA has probably broken into the email accounts of journalists and human rights activists in other countries. The lawyers who supervise these covert operations probably make sure to place limitations on what our cyber-spies are able to gather and collect, all in the name of limiting both the footprint of the attack and the self-inspection that comes with snooping on anyone’s email.

Chinese cyber espionage is scary. It’s also not surprising. The U.S. cannot easily claim the moral high ground.

1c

According to The New York Times:

SAN FRANCISCO — For the last four months, Chinese hackers have persistently attacked The New York Times, infiltrating its computer systems and getting passwords for its reporters and other employees.

After surreptitiously tracking the intruders to study their movements and help erect better defenses to block them, The Times and computer security experts have expelled the attackers and kept them from breaking back in.

The timing of the attacks coincided with the reporting for a Times investigation, published online on Oct. 25, that found that the relatives of Wen Jiabao, China’s prime minister, had accumulated a fortune worth several billion dollars through business dealings.

Security experts hired by The Times to detect and block the computer attacks gathered digital evidence that Chinese hackers, using methods that some consultants have associated with the Chinese military in the past, breached The Times’s network. They broke into the e-mail accounts of its Shanghai bureau chief, David Barboza, who wrote the reports on Mr. Wen’s relatives, and Jim Yardley, The Times’s South Asia bureau chief in India, who previously worked as bureau chief in Beijing. (excerpt of the nytimes article By )

1c


“We have to begin making it clear to the Chinese – they’re not the only people hacking us or attempting to hack us – that the United States is going to have to take action to protect not only our government’s, but our private sector, from this kind of illegal intrusions. There’s a lot that we are working on that will be deployed in the event that we don’t get some kind of international effort under way,” she said.

The Wall Street Journal on Thursday said that its computer systems, too, had been breached by China-based hackers in an effort to monitor the newspaper’s coverage of China issues.

The White House declined to comment on whether it will pursue aggressive action on China.

Source: AP

chin

Before moving on the The talk, we would like to recall Ben Parr’s article for Mashabe on Jan 14, 2010:

The entire world has been talking about Google’s decision to not censor its China search engine after it became the victim of Chinese cyber attack. And while we’ve talked a great deal about its global implications and the censorship in China, we haven’t talked a lot aboutexactly how Chinese hackers actually broke through Google’s security measures.

A recently published analysis by antivirus/computer security firm McAffee seems to have some of the answers.

They have launched an investigation into the attack that has turned up some interesting results, including the likely codename of the operation as well as a key vulnerability in Microsoft’s Internet Explorer that may have helped the hackers succeed.

(…)

The attack targeted a few key individuals to install malware and rip open a hole through security via Internet Explorer. McAffee made sure to note that the IE flaw was just one way the hackers infiltrated the networks of Google and 20+ other companies.

(…)

The hackers knew who they wanted to target and what they wanted and used vulnerabilities never before known to do it. The nature of the attack likely played a big role in Google’s decision.

The talk about it goes likes this (selection) : 

  • Betsy
  • New Jersey
I am struck (almost) dumb by the extent of the break-in and its possible implications for free speech. It makes one look back fondly on the legal pad and pen or scribbled notes on a cocktail napkin. 
No doubt the hackers wanted to scare away the newspaper, on whose reporting I depend, from making any further disclosures, possibly by threatening or harming the reporters. Today, after reading this article, I have more confidence than ever in the Times! 

  • Bob Sallamack
  • New Jersey

Americans need to wake up and understand that the internet is not a computer system but a communication system.

Imagine World War II in America where those of other nations could take over control of the American communication system of telephones and telegraphs during World War II. No one in government could use these communication systems in the United States during World War II. The military would have to use runners and carrier pigeons simply to contact those on military bases in the United States.

 

  • Boston Scrod
  • Massachusetts

How many of the compromised computers at the Times were running Linux or Mac OS X? My best guess is zero but I would be happy to be proven wrong.

Assuming, however, that I am right, the failure to address this point is probably but another example of giving cover to the fundamentally insoluble vulnerabilities unique to Microsoft’s operating systems. At the very least, the nature of the systems affected should be a leading point in the story, something made clear in the first or second paragraph.

Our nation is totally dependent upon the internet communication system of the United States but the United States has no ability to regulate or protect that system. Everything is simply left to private companies. Americans will scream it is an infringement on their rights if the government becomes involved.

 

  • Piri Halasz
  • New York NY

This has nothing to do with communism — China is simply acting like any captalist industrialist who wants to spy on the competition. They’re just better at it than most industrial spies in the US.

 

  • outta’here
  • Texas

Interesting to note that all this work was done and yet no “sensitive” information was compromised? How many folks really believe that whopper? No hacker would penetrate a target system to that level and not access sensitive data.

 

  • Alex
  • IN

So the Times itself was hacked, its computer systems infiltrated, and its data stolen. The Times is to be complimented on its forthright and informative reporting on the episode.

But I also hope the Times learns a lesson from this: anyone can be hacked. Perhaps the tone of your future reporting on security breaches that take place at other institutions can be a bit more understanding and less self-righteous than your articles have sometimes been in the past. Newspapers that publish from glass houses should be careful about how forcefully they throw stones at others.

Also, a bit more detail on what happened would be useful, so that others can learn. Did all the computer systems involved run Windows, or were Linux and/or Macintosh systems also affected?

 

  • Dr. Arthur Frederick Ide
  • Radcliffe IA

Hacking is never a victimless crime. It discourages researchers, writers, publishers, schools, and others from presenting information that hackers think should be in the public domain–never counting the time, energy, investigation and coorination of their works. Hackers bring down governments that they feel do not represent their special interest, but government brought down are representative of the very people the hackers claim the hackers represent. All hackers should be tried and when found guilty given the longest term possible in a prison without comforts.

 

To see The New York Times video follow the link below:

http://nyti.ms/XVgCoy

But China and America have a long story as we already mentioned a tiny part previously in the article “China has overtaken America Again: Patents and Liberty“.


As in

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/31/technology/chinese-hackers-infiltrate-new-york-times-computers.html?hp&_r=0

http://theweek.com/article/index/239513/how-china-justifies-its-cyber-attacks

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/9841385/US-considers-firmer-action-against-Chinese-cyber-espionage.html

http://mashable.com/2010/01/14/google-china-attack-anatomy/


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